|
|
Post by Inanimate on Oct 9, 2015 10:33:29 GMT -8
Advance (When you untap with ten or more permanents, you become advanced.)Reuben's Revolution (TAP, tap two untapped creatures you control: Transform all permanents with Revolution you control.) // As long as it's on the other face, it has "Permanents you control with Revolution enter the battlefield transformed." Access (7: Grant access to the machine.) // Whenever access is granted to the machine, EFFECT. Here is the link to the previous discussion thread about Advance.Use this topic for talking about Advance and its related variants (Reuben's Revolution, Industrial Revolution, Access the Machine, Tommy's Revolution) in general. If you have a concern that you feel warrants a new thread - for example, one that involves multiple mechanics at once, or is particularly noteworthy such as proposing a significantly different version of the mechanic - make a new thread for it. Otherwise, please use this thread. Advance is designed to capture the flavorful theme of progress. Its mechanical goal is to produce an interesting and radical change across multiple permanents, which involves a level of interactivity with the opponent - in many cases, a shields-down moment. Currently we're discussing how to find a happy medium between Advance and Reuben's Revolution.
|
|
|
|
Post by reuben on Oct 15, 2015 21:56:19 GMT -8
A huge amount of my revolution designs
Peaceful Protestors 3W
Creature — Human Citizen (U)
Revolution (T, Tap two other untapped creatures you control: Transform all creatures with revolution you control. Revolt only as a sorcery.)
Defender
0/6
---Flip---
Riotous Mob
Creatures with revolution you control enter the battlefield transformed.
Riotous Mob attacks each turn if able.
6/6
Repressed Worker W
Creature — Human Citizen (C)
Revolution (T, Tap two other untapped creatures you control: Transform all creatures with revolution you control. Revolt only as a sorcery.)
1/1
---Flip---
New Age Revolutionary
Creatures with revolution you control enter the battlefield transformed.
First Strike
2/2
Bazaar-District Tinkerer 2U
Creature — Human Artificer (C)
Revolution (T, Tap two other untapped creatures you control: Transform all creatures with revolution you control. Revolt only as a sorcery.)
“Blah! Short sighted state. How dare they cut my funding.”
2/2
---Flip---
Aeronautic Genius
Creatures with revolution you control enter the battlefield transformed.
Flying
3/3
Alley Scoundrel 3B
Creature — Human Rogue (C)
Revolution (T, Tap two other untapped creatures you control: Transform all creatures with revolution you control. Revolt only as a sorcery.)
“My quick tongue and my sharp knife are the only friends I’ll ever need.”
3/2
---Flip---
Parliamentary Officer
Creatures with revolution you control enter the battlefield transformed.
2B : Each opponent loses 1 life and you gain 1 life.
In the upheaval of the new age, many found a way to benefit themselves. Not always for society’s benefit.
3/4
Mercenary Enforcer 1B
Creature — Human Revolutionary (U)
Revolution (T, Tap two other untapped creatures you control: Transform all creatures with revolution you control. Revolt only as a sorcery.)
At the beginning of your upkeep you lose 2 life.
3/2
---Flip---
Police Captain
Creatures with revolution you control enter the battlefield transformed.
Lifelink
“My past has never been perfect, but I’ve now seen that the law should benefit all, not just myself.”
3/2
Slaughter of House Barir 4BB
Sorcery (R)
Destroy target creature an opponent controls. Each other creature that player controls gets -2/-2 until end of turn.
Transform all creatures with revolution you control.
|
|
|
|
Post by nichgrayson on Oct 21, 2015 7:47:04 GMT -8
As counterpoint to the technical advancement of the WuB Consul cities in Kaladesh, could this mechanic be uRG? It could be flavored around the rebels, both tinkerers and magic users, living on the fringe of society.
[DAY]
Rope Maker
G
Creature - Human
1/1
Revolution 2G (2G, T, Tap two other untapped creatures you control: Transform each permanent with revolution you control. Revolt only as a sorcery.)
///
[NITE][Green color identity]
Vinewhip Mage
Creature - Human Shaman
3/3
Reach
[DAY]
Rebellious Impulse
R
Enchantment - Aura
Enchant creature
Enchanted creature has "Revolution 1R (1R, T, Tap two other untapped creatures you control: Transform each permanent with revolution you control. Revolt only as a sorcery.)"
///
[NITE][Red color identity]
Rebellious Convinction
Enchantment - Aura
Enchant creature
Enchanted creature gets +1/+1 and has double strike.
You can see where I'm going with this.
FWIW, I think Revolution should have a mana cost too. The early drops should cost more to activate than the mid to large size ones because as sson as you cast your threshhold creature, the little revolutionaries are going to transform everyone right away. Adding a mana cost to that seems important to make the shields down moment more meaningful.
|
|
|
|
Post by Inanimate on Oct 21, 2015 15:43:53 GMT -8
Adding a mana cost is a good idea. It also makes the decision of who to participate in the initial 'revolution' (the three tapped) more meaningful.
These designs seem nice. I'm still worried about whether we can find a way to get revolution on artifacts.
|
|
|
|
Post by reuben on Oct 22, 2015 22:05:02 GMT -8
Is revolution on artifacts really a huge deal? Also I don't mind the mana cost if we really need another development knob but it does create slightly more tracking complexity for your opponent to know when you can transform.
I mean if it is for flavor reasons then you can just create a creature holding or associated with said artifact.
can you give me some examples of top down artifact designs that could function with the revolution?
some more designs...
Supporter of the Cause 1WW
Creature — Human Citizen (U)
Revolution (T, Tap two other untapped creatures you control: Transform all creatures with revolution you control. Revolt only as a sorcery.)
"We have been repressed long enough. Something needs to change."
2/2
---Flip---
Marie's Bannerman
Creature — Human Citizen (U)
Creatures with revolution you control enter the battlefield transformed.
Other creatures you control get +1/+1.
"Let the community rise up to create a better world!"
3/2
Disgruntled Brutes 2RR
Creature — Human Warrior (U)
Revolution (T, Tap two other untapped creatures you control: Transform all creatures with revolution you control. Revolt only as a sorcery.)
Menace
"We don't like no consul lackeys on our turf."
4/2
---Flip---
Demolisher Gang
Creature — Human Warrior (U)
Creatures with revolution you control enter the battlefield transformed.
Menace
Whenever an artifact you don't control dies, ~ deals 2 damage to its controller.
The consul's attempts to pacify some districts turned resentment into rage.
4/4
|
|
|
|
Post by radicaljackal on Oct 22, 2015 23:03:23 GMT -8
This probably isn't feasible with all of the other counters that want to be in the set but I figure I will throw this into the brainstorm
Revolting Lord 2W
Creature - Human
Revolution 2WW(2WW, TAP, tap two untapped creatures you control: put a Revolution counter on each creature you tapped for this. Revolt only as a sorcery.)
If you control at least 1 creature with a Revolution counter, creatures you control have +1/+1
2/2
With this all of your revolting creatures can get turned on by seeing that you control at least 1 creature with a Revolution counter, but they don't all keep the revolution going. You get a bit of redundancy but if you make some trades in combat, your opponent can end the revolution with some removal. With the version I am seeing above it seems like it is too easy for a revolution too last the rest of the game, or at least until it stopped being relevant anyway. Apart from a few rares it is hard to kill all of your opponents creatures at once and not be about to win.
In my example the turned on mode grants something to all of your creatures instead of just getting bigger itself. I think this could be a good direction to go with this mechanic (like some kind of sliver rally space) but this isn't really related to my first point.
|
|
|
|
Post by Inanimate on Oct 27, 2015 8:45:54 GMT -8
reuben: The original idea behind this mechanic was to represent advancement in all forms, but with an especial focus on technological advancement and upgrades. It would appear on creatures as well, but it would represent not only societal progress, but also their changing technologies that empower them.
Without this mechanic representing the 'upgrading' of technology, it's certainly possible to represent that elsewhere - just like Innistrad had many DFC cards alongside Werewolves, we could have Revolution alongside other DFC cards that represent 'invention' and Eureka moments, or something. But still, it'd be nice if the Revolution mechanic appeared on technology, as that was really a fundamental part of the Industrial Revolution (which this mechanic would be partly capturing, I hope)
|
|
|
|
Post by nichgrayson on Nov 5, 2015 13:05:44 GMT -8
I am trying a version of Reuben's Revolution in my playtest in RGW, with a few tweaks. There are non-creature spells that can transform if your in revolt. Actually, I called it Rebellion, because rather than have a trigger telling you to flip on the backside, I have all the transformed creatures gain the creature type, Rebel. It's complicated, just look at the cards I'm trying and a enabler I included. Oh, here's the Flavor Concept first: The iron grip of the Consul has created a growing sense of dissidence and unrest. Non-Human races, like the Aven, reject the menial role in society they’ve been given and fight for freedom. Elementalists and Mages are tired of being hunting for practicing Magic. And some citizens are just fighting the rigid caste structure of society. This would be the major conflict of the Block.
Chained Fledgling
1W
Creature — Bird Soldier
0/3
Defender
Flying
Rebellion 4W (4W, T, Tap two other untapped creatures you control: Transform each permanent with rebellion you control. Activate rebellion only any time you could cast a sorcery.)
---Flip---
Aven Freedom Glider
Creature — Bird Soldier Rebel
3/3
Flying
Whenever you cast a spell with rebellion, you may transform it.
Rabble Alley Rumors
3W
Instant
You may transform this spell when you cast it, if you control a Rebel.
Creatures you control gets +1/+2 until end of turn.
---Flip---
Rebellion Crier
Creature – Bird Soldier Rebel
2/1
Flying, first strike
Chimney Union Boss
3R
Creature — Goblin
3/1
Haste
Rebellion R (R, T, Tap two other untapped creatures you control: Transform each permanent with rebellion you control. Activate rebellion only any time you could cast a sorcery.)
---Flip---
Smokeblinder Mage
Creature — Goblin Shaman Rebel
3/1
First strike, haste
Whenever you cast a spell with rebellion, you may transform it.
Firebomb
3RR
Sorcery
You may transform this spell when you cast it, if you control a Rebel.
Firebomb deals 5 damage to each opponent.
---Flip---
Bomb Thrower
Creature – Human Shaman Rebel
2/2
When Bomb Thrower enters the battlefield, it deals 2 damage to target creature.
Cable Braider
1G
Creature — Human
1/2
Hexproof
Rebellion 4G (4G, T, Tap two other untapped creatures you control: Transform each permanent with rebellion you control. Activate rebellion only any time you could cast a sorcery.)
---Flip---
Whipvine Mage
Creature — Human Shaman Rebel
3/4
Hexproof
Whenever you cast a spell with rebellion, you may transform it.
Spread the Pollen
2G
Instant
You may transform this spell when you cast it, if you control a Rebel.
Prevent all combat damage that would be dealt this turn.
---Flip---
Spore Choker
Creature – Elf Shaman Rebel
2/1
When Spore Choker enters the battlefield, prevent all combat damage that other creatures would be dealt this turn.
Rebel Leaflet
3
Artifact
You may transform this spell when you cast it, if you control a Rebel.
T: Add 1 to your mana pool.
---Flip---
Leaflet Dispenser
Artifact Creature – Construct
2/2
T: Add 1 to your mana pool.
2, Sacrifice Leaflet Dispenser: You draw a card.
In Hiding
1GInstant
Target creature gains hexproof until end of turn. Put a +1/+1 counter on it and untap it, if you control a Rebel.
|
|
|
|
Post by Inanimate on Nov 5, 2015 13:09:31 GMT -8
Interesting take! I'm not sure I like making it just Rebellion and Rebels, because then we lose the flavor of it also including industrial and technological revolution. It does make the flavor more clear and powerful, though.
|
|
|
|
Post by jaytreat on Nov 5, 2015 13:53:45 GMT -8
Can the flip side of sorceries be all-upside?
Firebomb
3RR
Sorcery
You may transform this spell when you cast it, if you control a Rebel.
Firebomb deals 5 damage to each opponent.
---Flip---
Bomb Thrower
Creature – Human Shaman Rebel
2/2
When Bomb Thrower enters the battlefield, it deals 5 damage to each opponent.
|
|
|
|
Post by nichgrayson on Nov 5, 2015 14:18:49 GMT -8
Inanimate, that's a good point. I hadn't considered the flavor loss.
Jay, that's where I started. Then when it got hard to create fair effects thst cost the same, I started designing them more generically as a creature and a spell you could get for the same mana cost. Then I made the flip optional so it's almost like having a split card.
|
|
